Scraping Foetus Off The Phone

An Interview with Jim Thirlwell

We sent Grip's own enigmatic, shine-pated scion of the late-night airwaves Aaron "Egghead" Landsman down to a pay phone to talk to Jim Thirlwell.

Of course, the prolific Thirlwell's the man who has given us such life-affirming musical projects as Scraping Foetus Off the Wheel, You've Got Foetus on Your Breath, Foetus Art Terrorism and just plain old Foetus. His most recent album, a collaboration with Lydia Lunch designed to accompany an on-site installation under Brooklyn Bridge, came out earlier in the year on the Atavistic label to widespread critical acclaim.

Aaron and Jim discussed drinks, the street, restraining orders, working with Ms. Lunch, and the creation of 12 years of in-your-face art, with an occasional big-band trumpet.

J.T. Egghead?

Grip Yes. Hello.

J.T. This is J.G. Thirlwell.

Grip How ya doing? This has been a long awaited conversation for me, man. How much time do we have for this?

J.T. What?

Grip How much time do we have for this?

J.T. Well, how much time do you need?... Just start talking.

Grip All right, man. Who, or what, do you find to be the most influential on your work?

J.T. To me?

Grip Mm-hmm.

J.T. Jeez, I'd have to say the street.

Grip The street. O.K..

J.T. My environment is most important. Musically I've gone through a lot of, um... I feel that there's certain elements of my music that have been influenced by various disparate people. Anywhere from John Cage to the Residents to David Bowie to just walking down the street and hearing stuff. I try to place an embargo on listening to any existing music when I'm creating because I want to create from as deep a place as possible. I don't want to be repossessing and reproducing other people's ideas. They come from deep within me. However, I'm influenced as much by a commercial on TV for a financial firm as I am by "Wheaties" or "The Simpsons." You know, stuff like that.

Grip Are you satisfied with the outcome of the "Foetus Symphony Orchestra" Project?

J.T. Oh, yeah. It's a snapshot in time. It's a document of Brooklyn and the neighborhood that I live in and I'm telling a story and for me it was like one of the most ambitious things I could ever do because I backed out on it like five times and it's something I had to do.

Grip How long did it take you to complete the project?

J.T. Uh, let's see. Two days.

Grip Two days? Really?

J.T. The realization of it was one day of recording, one day of mixing. The actual realization of it was not only weeks, but if you think about it, the input to it, years. It was really years.

Grip It's got some interesting pieces on it. I just recently got to hear a copy of it. Are you going to do any more work with that particular collaboration of people.

J.T. No.

Grip Do you have any plans for releasing any spoken or written word material in the future?

J.T. No.

Grip So what would be your dream collaborative effort?

J.T. I would say, like, me, David Bowie and the Residents.

Grip Wow. That would be interesting. That would definitely be interesting.. Now, let's go back a little bit. On your album, Gash... the song, "Slung, is that in reference to a specific individual?

J.T. Yes.

Grip Might I inquire as to whom?

J.T. Oh my God. Well, Gash like, uh, well. There's "All my brothers listen to me/ you don't wanna get T.B". Um, that's her initials. I'm not going to say who it was. It's this girl I went out with for two and a half years. The ironic thing is that the song, "Downfall", on Gash, is about her, and it was kind of prophetic, because she... Anyway, I wrote the song about her. There's a lot of subtext in that album, you know, it being called Gash. It was a short film. First of all. It was a short film we made together and we had a very tempestuous relationship that ended in, um, basically bottles being thrown at each other and, how can I say it? Where are you at exactly?

Grip Charlottesville, Virginia.

J.T. O.K.. So she's not gonna hear this. She took a restraining order against me the day before I did "Downfall", hence the particularly vicious vocal on that.

Grip Yeah. That's an intense piece, man.

J.T. And "Slung" talks about her a lot. We were in a relationship for about two and a half years and I found out, second hand, that she was messing around with me and hence, the venom that is in those particular songs. And, I dunno, very nasty.

Grip Which one of your pieces from the past do you think best reflects your life or persona?

J.T. About my persona?

Grip About yourself. Which one do you think personifies you the most?

J.T. All of them. Most recently I would say Gash. All about nasty relationships with a girl. The next album is all about girls, it's starting to be about girls. I have a fairly passionate personality.

Grip Yeah, I've been listening to your music for a long time, I've noticed that.

J.T. And Gash has particularly acerbic observations about what was going on my life at that time.And, believe me, it wasn't my fault. And, I don't know, I saw that girl a little bit after that and I had to bite my tongue. She knew it was stuff about her but she didn't listen to it. Unfortunately, I fell back in love with her!

Grip Mm-hmm. I know the feeling there too, man.

J.T. Oh God. But I backed away because it was too destructive. They all [the songs] talk about a lot of different girls but they also talk about deep insights into my life and environmental situation.

Grip Why did you choose to use the word "Foetus" in most of your working band-names?

J.T. Well, it's catchy. It's the lowest common denominator as well.

Grip Without a doubt.

J.T. We've all been fetuses. It's the lowest common denominator. It's a social imperative, a physical imperative.

Grip What advice would you give to aspiring musicians?

J.T. I would say quit. I would say don't join a band. In fact, I would advocate having a seven day waiting period for a guitar. Because there's too many bands around.... And be passionate. And rehearse, rehearse, rehearse and come up with something original.

Grip There does seem to be a proliferation of crap being pumped out all over the place.

J.T. There are too many bands out there. I think people should just play for their own devices, and not inflict the world with that and not try to get a record deal. I would say play for a long time before you even decide to put out a record. You have to become brilliant.

Grip I think that would be good advice for a lot of people to follow. How do you feel about critics?

J.T. They're a necessary evil. Personally, I'm my own biggest critic. I'm very critical of my own work. But basically I think they should all be lined up against the wall and shot.

Grip You worked with Lydia Lunch on the Symphony Orchestra project. What was it like working with her?

J.T. Very easy. Very easy. We lived together for like seven years. She basically delegates the whole initiative to me, which is the way that I want because I can take the ball and run with it. I think I'm more well versed than her in what needs to be realized but what she brings to the project is invaluable. I have the luxury of editing that and we have a great working relationship where if I tell her to shut up, she'll shut up.

Grip That would be something I'd love to witness. I've listened to her before. She does tend to rant. (Jim laughs) OK, now I have a series of silly, mundane questions some friends of mine put forth to me. The first one being, what's you favorite drink?

J.T. Let's see... alcoholic drink?

Grip Yeah.

J.T. I like vodka. I like margaritas. I like Long Island Iced Tea. I also like Snapple kiwi strawberry. I guess my favorite drink is water.

Grip Finish this progression Peace, love and....?

J.T. Peace, love and hell.

Grip What do you do when you have spare time and want to kick back and relax.

J.T. Sleep.

Grip So how long do you think it'll be before your next album is released?

J.T. My next album? Next year.